Cops and why they should be nerfed. (A Short Novel)

#1
(This post was last modified: 19-05-2018, 02:04 AM by Program.)

Cops should be nerfed. They are extremely OP In almost every aspect of the game. Raiding? Check. They have the *ram*  Getting Rid of Other Humans? Double Check. Instant Arrest and Fairly quick *ratatata* With their gun and your dead.  Theres No real way to stop a cop until they actually taze and arrest you, because its RDM. And if they "RDA" you then they can make up a reason why they did it. This isn't a staff issue because there is no way to stop this besides the almighty n e r f. I think a /arrest {Name} before the arrest can help combat this without breaking the Tazer or stunstick. But making the stun take multiple hits to fully disable a criminal would most likely help too. Also if the need to *rtatatatat* you they could have a better means of doing this like "/ad Pull out your phys gun and crouch or you will be shot ETC." Might help be able to tell whether its RDA with /arrest {Name} and RDM "/ad Stop Running And ... ". But Im open to replys and criticism. Thanks!
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#2

Hi!

I can definitely see where you're coming from, but...
they're supposed to be more powerful than other classes. They've been trained extensively and are government-funded, and they're only allowed to intervene if someone's actually breaking laws.
They can only use this "extra power" for good, eg. only if you're breaking the laws. They're not supposed to be defeated easily, especially not if you're by yourself.

They cannot make up reasons to RDA you. If you didn't break any laws, it's RDA- period. By nerfing all police you're not taking care of these RDAers.
Likewise, there's legal ways to earn money, and you do not need to have guns out all the time. You are taking a calculated risk by printing money/bitmining/cooking meth/mugging etc. being "more money but i might get arrested".

Wanted reasons would just add another step, people would start using them as binds, and the suggestion i'd added below also includes reasons (but only after the arrest).

This is a thread I've created to nerf them a little bit, taking away one of the main unfair & unrealistic aspects, or at least giving friends an opportunity to get revenge on the arresting officer:
https://www.hawkservers.co/showthread.php?tid=3833
(it also has the added bonus of avoiding a lot of wasted time for the cop and staff member alike in "RDA" sits)

If police would try to get people to yield, they would just get shot in the face 99% of the time. Most of the time they start shooting is either because people are getting away (no time to advert, victim'd be gone) or because people are attacking them (no time to advert, police'd be dead).

As for tazing someone twice before disabling them... i kind of agree that the Shocker isn't fun to fight against. It's not supposed to be, of course, but maybe the freeze should be turned into a BIG decrease in sensitivity (your crosshair moves super slow) and your movement speed set to 10, plus the inability to jump. (then we can use this for mugs too)
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#3

"They're supposed to be powerful"

Yes where that is true it also completely dispelled his point. They're OP not powerful. You could just be standing in the street and then you get taxed, you can't physically run or see when you're taxed so you're a sitting duck for his arrest baton. The shocker and tazer make the police more OP than neccessary
[Image: lapudoa8763.gif]
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#4
(This post was last modified: 19-05-2018, 09:09 AM by Exhility.)

I wouldn't be standing in the street with 0 awareness knowing I'm breaking the law.
~ Hating something popular doesn't make you an interesting person. 
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#5

(19-05-2018, 05:44 AM)Sorkbonkler Wrote: As for tazing someone twice before disabling them... i kind of agree that the Shocker isn't fun to fight against. It's not supposed to be, of course, but maybe the freeze should be turned into a BIG decrease in sensitivity (your crosshair moves super slow) and your movement speed set to 10, plus the inability to jump. (then we can use this for mugs too)

(19-05-2018, 08:53 AM)KittyBlue Wrote: "They're supposed to be powerful"
Yes where that is true it also completely dispelled his point.
I did not.
(19-05-2018, 05:44 AM)Sorkbonkler Wrote: As for tazing someone twice before disabling them... i kind of agree that the Shocker isn't fun to fight against. It's not supposed to be, of course, but maybe the freeze should be turned into a BIG decrease in sensitivity (your crosshair moves super slow) and your movement speed set to 10, plus the inability to jump. (then we can use this for mugs too)

(19-05-2018, 08:53 AM)KittyBlue Wrote: They're OP not powerful. You could just be standing in the street and then you get taxed, you can't physically run or see when you're taxed so you're a sitting duck for his arrest baton. The shocker and tazer make the police more OP than neccessary

They are supposed to be OP, then. Overpowered is probably the right word- because they should be feared, you should be cautious around them, you should know that you can't blatantly break laws and get away with it. You still have a fighting chance. Keep them at range, or move in groups so that your buddy can shoot the cop that tazed you.

And before anyone brings up the "in real life cops are less armored" or "it would take time to escort someone to the police department" arguments or anything similar to those, in real life you don't respawn after you're dead and in real life you don't get 3 minutes of jailtime for mass murder. This is DarkRP. Not real life.

They will not taze you if you're "just standing in the street".
If you're blatantly holding out illegal weapons (their decision), mugging or kidnapping someone (their decision), money printing/meth cooking/bitmining (their decision) or raiding/stealing (their decision). The police will not taze you if you are not breaking laws. You, as a player, decide to break laws, to take these risks in exchange for things like earning extra money. You do not need to break these laws.

The "tazed before arrest" was added because people were complaining about baton rushing. With the taze being nessecary before arresting, companions have a chance to kill the officer before he arrests the guy he tazed.
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#6

(19-05-2018, 09:12 AM)Sorkbonkler Wrote:
(19-05-2018, 05:44 AM)Sorkbonkler Wrote: As for tazing someone twice before disabling them... i kind of agree that the Shocker isn't fun to fight against. It's not supposed to be, of course, but maybe the freeze should be turned into a BIG decrease in sensitivity (your crosshair moves super slow) and your movement speed set to 10, plus the inability to jump. (then we can use this for mugs too)

(19-05-2018, 08:53 AM)KittyBlue Wrote: "They're supposed to be powerful"
Yes where that is true it also completely dispelled his point.
I did not.
(19-05-2018, 05:44 AM)Sorkbonkler Wrote: As for tazing someone twice before disabling them... i kind of agree that the Shocker isn't fun to fight against. It's not supposed to be, of course, but maybe the freeze should be turned into a BIG decrease in sensitivity (your crosshair moves super slow) and your movement speed set to 10, plus the inability to jump. (then we can use this for mugs too)

(19-05-2018, 08:53 AM)KittyBlue Wrote: They're OP not powerful. You could just be standing in the street and then you get taxed, you can't physically run or see when you're taxed so you're a sitting duck for his arrest baton. The shocker and tazer make the police more OP than neccessary

They are supposed to be OP, then. Overpowered is probably the right word- because they should be feared, you should be cautious around them, you should know that you can't blatantly break laws and get away with it. You still have a fighting chance. Keep them at range, or move in groups so that your buddy can shoot the cop that tazed you.

And before anyone brings up the "in real life cops are less armored" or "it would take time to escort someone to the police department" arguments or anything similar to those, in real life you don't respawn after you're dead and in real life you don't get 3 minutes of jailtime for mass murder. This is DarkRP. Not real life.

They will not taze you if you're "just standing in the street".
If you're blatantly holding out illegal weapons (their decision), mugging or kidnapping someone (their decision), money printing/meth cooking/bitmining (their decision) or raiding/stealing (their decision). The police will not taze you if you are not breaking laws. You, as a player, decide to break laws, to take these risks in exchange for things like earning extra money. You do not need to break these laws.

The "tazed before arrest" was added because people were complaining about baton rushing. With the taze being nessecary before arresting, companions have a chance to kill the officer before he arrests the guy he tazed.
Well as you have said cops dont Taze you randomly for doing nothing. This is what most do. There are very few "good" CPs and this makes them a class to be feared like you said. But this also means when you see one and are doing nothing wrong you have to fear "Is he gonna kill me?" "Is he gonna arrest me? when you have done nothing wrong. My main issue is not cops RDMing but RDA. If you could make it so its *Taze-Detain-Arrest* these seems like a good idea. Handcuffs that when used Act like the "Mug" command in the sense that you cant move. This can give you time to explain your pov and be able to have a friend "bust you out". And if the cop wanted to send you straight to jail he still can. As i think detain would take just 1 hit to do. [Another Baton] To me cops seem like a big Power Trip for people who want to get rid of that guy over there. As for making up reasons for arrest this happens often. Some but not limited too "He had a gun out after i told him to drop it" "He Wouldnt let me weapons scan him" Etc. Either way I do hope we do something about CPs without making it unfun to play. I typically play Swat and  am the highest rank with it but even i feel its to OP to be able to instantly without much hassle to send someone to jail for raiding or RDM because you just sneak up on them and taze and BOOM gone.
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#7
(This post was last modified: 19-05-2018, 12:04 PM by Exhility.)

Quote:If you could make it so its *Taze-Detain-Arrest* these seems like a good idea. Handcuffs that when used Act like the "Mug" command in the sense that you cant move. This can give you time to explain your pov and be able to have a friend "bust you out". And if the cop wanted to send you straight to jail he still can. As i think detain would take just 1 hit to do.

This will not stop RDA. Just takes an extra second to arrest someone. If someone has the intent of RDAing, which you're trying to stop, why do you think cops should still be able to send someone straight to jail? There's no core, valid suggestion.

Staff stop RDA, not nerfing a whole category of jobs because of a few bad apples.
~ Hating something popular doesn't make you an interesting person. 
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#8

(19-05-2018, 12:01 PM)Exhility Wrote:
Quote:If you could make it so its *Taze-Detain-Arrest* these seems like a good idea. Handcuffs that when used Act like the "Mug" command in the sense that you cant move. This can give you time to explain your pov and be able to have a friend "bust you out". And if the cop wanted to send you straight to jail he still can. As i think detain would take just 1 hit to do.

This will not stop RDA.

Staff stop RDA, not nerfing a whole category of jobs because of a few bad apples.

I dont feel this is nerfing, I feel this is balancing.

This would also add to the roleplay aspect and even if they still WANTed to send you right to jail then they can.
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#9
(This post was last modified: 19-05-2018, 12:21 PM by Exhility.)

Your suggested nerfs balances don't do anything to prevent RDA, which is what you spoke about in your OP. 

1. Making the tazer need multiple hits just asks for cops to be immediately be sniped in the face, making them shit.
2. Their submachine gun is shit too, so you can't complain about it being broken.
3. Staff usually do their job right, and won't just allow people to make up reasons. In most cases, the cop would need to point towards the law that the person was breaking, and this can't be made up. The only scenario where the cop would be able to make something up is where the law break can't be found in the logs or the person has no recording; this is rare.
4. As Sork said, having to put up an advert (unless you're in a group with other cops) is a huge nerf to cops, as the person would have a direct reason to kill you, and you have very little time to react to them shooting you, rendering you a sitting duck waiting to be killed.

The only thing I can see from your point of view is the battering ram a little too powerful. However, the cop can do literally nothing while breaking down the doors, while criminals can have their gun out while waiting for their EMP to explode. With the battering ram up, cops have little movement speed and can't use weapons. Just kill them.

It took a while to get cops out of their weak, useless position in the server, and I feel this suggestion will just put them right back where they were.
~ Hating something popular doesn't make you an interesting person. 
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#10

(19-05-2018, 12:04 PM)Program Wrote:
(19-05-2018, 12:01 PM)Exhility Wrote:
Quote:If you could make it so its *Taze-Detain-Arrest* these seems like a good idea. Handcuffs that when used Act like the "Mug" command in the sense that you cant move. This can give you time to explain your pov and be able to have a friend "bust you out". And if the cop wanted to send you straight to jail he still can. As i think detain would take just 1 hit to do.

This will not stop RDA.

Staff stop RDA, not nerfing a whole category of jobs because of a few bad apples.

I dont feel this is nerfing, I feel this is balancing.

This would also add to the roleplay aspect and even if they still WANTed to send you right to jail then they can.

I'm going to have to agree with Exhility in this regard- nothing you suggested will stop people from RDAing any more than it will stop regular officers from doing their job correctly.

Heck, it'll make it harder for "good cops" that want to go over the reason because they're going to get killed in self-defense, and RDAing officers would still just arrest.

Police isn't supposed to be balanced. They are supposed to be more powerful than criminals. It makes sense for them to be, too.
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